| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
   |
Posted - 2007.07.06 09:48:00 -
[1]
 Originally by: Ulrich Sternaxe
whining because I wasn't careful and got screwed by this
Be more careful and stop whining. EVE is designed to be PVP, and the Market PVP is just as harsh as anything ship-to-ship, if not more.
This is by design. Whining will not change it. Whining will just get people to laugh at you because wow, you lose at forum PVP too. 
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 10:34:00 -
[2]
To be a bit more clear and less hateful:
This game is designed with PVP in mind. This has been said several times by the EVE devs, and I'm sure someone with more time than I have can find a quote if they've got a mind to.
This game is the only successful MMORPG designed entirely with PVP and PVPers in mind. There are literally hundreds of PVE MMOs out there, many of them sci-fi in nature. Whenever you come along and ask that some PVP element or another be removed, you're ruining the experience for hundreds of thousands of people who accept and even desire the PVP that they can't get elsewhere.
I guess what I'm saying is that if you don't want PVP, this game is not for you. It's not any sort of condemnation of you on my part. I can truly understand that people don't want to play in a universe where all of their hard work can be blown up by someone else. The thing is, some people DO want that, some people actually seek that out. Every single time you make a post like this asking for the PVP to be dumbed down in some way, you're ruining the game for those of us who like it this way.
In the end, posts like this make you look like a real jerk. You've got so many options available to you, and those of us who like real hardcore PVP have so very few. Stop being a jerk and go find a game better suited to you.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 11:16:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Ricdic
Personally, I would always recommend reviewing transactions BEFORE you press OK that first time, not when you get a warning box pop up 
This is really the heart of the matter. Everything else exists secondary to this one idea. Watch your own back, because no one else is going to watch it for you. Be careful, because you will be screwed if you are not.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 15:32:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Daeva Vios on 06/07/2007 15:35:39
Edited by: Daeva Vios on 06/07/2007 15:32:42
I guess what I'm seeing, Shar, is you trying to make excuses for someone who fell for one of the oldest tricks there is in the market game, despite the warning provided by the system to prevent this from happening.
The rule in EVE has ALWAYS been to watch yourself, anyone who has played for any appreciable period of time learns this lesson and most players learn it the hard way. Most players accept that they made a stupid mistake and are more careful next time.
The problem I'm having with this post and the replies that have come after it is that their attitude seems to be against the ability to even attempt to pull this trick. This runs contrary to the idea of the free market, and I've seen you get pretty heated up by others who've suggested limiting the freedom of the market.
While I could be convinced that the warning should default to the safest outcome (note the 'could be' because this post simply doesn't cut it), I do not for a minute believe that anything should be done to eliminate this tactic, and that seems to be what's being advocated by several individuals here, and the OP's attitude is definitely one of hostility despite his choice to dress it up into a 'guide' for pulling this off.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 16:14:00 -
[5]
Really, could you not have waited until I actually said what I had to say?
I'm doing what I can to maintain my position and not ruin the whole thing by having it turn into a stupid argument. I guess if you're just going to try to insult me there's no point in that.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 18:49:00 -
[6]
Shar, you're the one being nasty and insulting here.
The fact is, the entire problem the OP stated can be completely avoided if the buyer uses the Details tab instead of the Groups tab to buy things. On the seller's side, clicking "View Market Details" instead of "Sell This Item" achieves the very purpose you're fighting for: freeing buyers and sellers from their own inability to read a warning message.
The mechanic you're calling for doesn't exist because it is absolutely unnecessary. The problem is not a problem of UI design or mechanics issues. It is one of sheer laziness.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 20:04:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Bah... Sorry I forgot. This is the internet and intelligence is not required.
Seems like an insult to me. Oh...no...wait...we must be changing the definition of the word. Please, tell us the new definition Shar.
I guess we're arguing semantics here, too.
Originally by: Shar Tegral
To avoid this happenstance he suggested a reasonable interface "tweak" that makes allot of sense.
Call it a tweak or call it whatever the hell you want, in the end the "tweak" suggested will perform a function, the nature of which seems remarkably similar to that of other game mechanics...at least according to my dictionary. Which are you using?
So you're arguing semantics in order to avoid the point that the "tweak" (being nice here and using your words instead of the words used in the vernacular) suggested is, as outlined by my above post, completely invalid.
From your statements in the above post, you are guilty of the same thing you're accusing others of...you did not even bother to check that the issue I was addressing was the very same as the subject introduced by the OP.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 20:36:00 -
[8]
You've got me half-convinced this is a conspiracy between you and Shar to pull a fast one on the rest of the folks here.
I hope this post wasn't serious to begin with, because it's become a complete joke. You're not even bothering to address valid arguments anymore.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 20:54:00 -
[9]
Ok. I've said a number of times that I completely understand that your point is to move the default option on the warning window from the positive to the negative. I have displayed several times that I do, in fact, understand it. I then proceeded to provide ample argument against the change.
In response, both of you attack me and insult me?
How dare I disagree with you! I should have known that this was never about reasoned discussion, but simply about you demanding support and flaming everyone who opposed you.
Believe me, I'll do my level best to keep from making that mistake again.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 21:11:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Daeva Vios on 06/07/2007 21:11:38
Edited by: Daeva Vios on 06/07/2007 21:10:56
Originally by: Taikun
Open Message to CCP
Want to fix this entire issue?
Change the single line of code in the warning dialogue box from defaulting from 'yes' to 'no' and you will destroy this entire market over night.
Right at the end of your two-post rant. Amazingly, I can quote as well.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
|
Posted - 2007.07.06 21:44:00 -
[11]
My point is that the warning box is irrelevant because if you're watching what you're doing, it isn't going to come up. Sell orders default to the highest buying price in an area that includes your current station, and if you then click "Sell" you get that price, fairly self-explanatory.
If you modify that price, you get a warning if you've modified it lower than a certain percentage of the regional average. This warning is not the only opportunity you get to make sure you've typed in the right price. You also have all the time in the world to make certain the price is right, there's no timer to limit how long you can spend counting digits.
Yet, in true carebear fashion, you choose to ignore the fact that you've got every opportunity to turn back even BEFORE you reach the warning. This is exactly, EXACTLY the same as choosing to go through a gate into low sec. Once you started warping to the gate, you had time to consider your action and look over what was going to be happening when you pressed that "Jump" button. The fact that you chose not to is your fault, not the fault of the person who set the buy order you're now selling to.
Accidents that would warrant a change like the one you're proposing are something you need to deal with on your own. If you slip up maybe you need to watch yourself and be more careful next time.
In over three years of playing this game, I have never experienced any problem with this, and from the responses in this thread I'm not the only one. Perhaps...and this is just conjecture here...perhaps this problem might be a little bit more local than you think.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
Anvil.
|
Posted - 2007.07.07 08:44:00 -
[12]
Ricdic is saying this far more eloquently and with less hostility than I can.
You made mistakes that could have been easily prevented had you taken a few simple precautions. Instead of accepting that you made those mistakes, you're blaming someone else.
The problem is, the devs didn't make you enter the wrong price, nor did they then make you hit enter twice.
I personally want to be able to hit Enter twice and have my order go through, because I double and triple check my pricing before my fingers go anywhere near my Enter key. To be slowed down will decrease my enjoyment of this game, and then I'll have to write a whiny post about it here and flame everyone who disagrees. No one wants that. 
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
Anvil.
|
Posted - 2007.07.07 09:12:00 -
[13]
You're hilarious. 
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
Anvil.
|
Posted - 2007.07.07 11:34:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Daeva Vios on 07/07/2007 11:37:19
Seriously? You need to lighten up. You flamed people for disagreeing with you. Bad form  but good humor for those of us who don't invest in as much righteous indignation as you do.
I do believe this thread has lost its original focus. Shame.
|
Daeva Vios
Ardent Adversary
Anvil.
|
Posted - 2007.07.07 15:16:00 -
[15]
Actually, my purpose was to provide a dissenting viewpoint. Since this was unacceptable to both of you, you decided to respond with hostility and anger. Kind of a trollish maneuver, there. Please do come down off your high horse, you've both insulted and attacked me and the others who have disagreed with you in this thread.
I've stated the dissenting view several times, as have others, and in none of these cases has the post been answered with anything other than Taikun boldly stating the poster has no idea what he's talking about or you stating the poster is a troll.
As for the number of posts, though it is entirely irrelevant to the topic at hand, I've got quite a few more than 20 lifetime posts. Most of them are answers to questions posted in the New Citizen Q&A, a few in C&P, one or two in S,S&O, and a couple in Out of Pod Experience. I've been around a while, and you not having seen me much is not a surprise if you spend all of your time in this forum alone.
|
| |
|